[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign.
Welcome back again to another episode of Conservation Stories brought to you by the Sand Hill Area Research association, or SARAH, as most of you know, we like to call it. Today we have with us a friend, a Playa Lake friend, Joe Richards. And Joe, you are now working with Pilate Joint Venture.
So most of our listeners will know that we have a concern for Playas. And I think it's a well founded concern and I think that they're kind of a low hanging fruit of a water, maybe decades long, but water solution, right?
[00:00:44] Speaker B: Yes, ma'. Am. Well, for starters, I just want to say thank you. I'm very honored to be on your podcast and I've gotten to listen to several episodes.
Glad to be here and glad to visit with you about Playas.
[00:00:56] Speaker A: Well, you know what happened to me last week? Someone came up to me and said, I listened to your podcast. I was like, somebody take a picture. Somebody take a picture. He listens to my podcast.
[00:01:08] Speaker B: Well, yeah, and there's a lot of great podcasts out there related to Playas.
The one you do with La Donna Clayton and her work in eastern New Mexico and Clovis, the work that Steve Rockwood is doing with Ducks Unlimited. I mean, all great stuff. So I'm really honored to be on here and to talk about it from Playa Lakes Joint Venture and Tomorrow's Water.
[00:01:29] Speaker A: Yeah, that's great. So we've had Heather has been on some. But Heather Johnson with Texas Parks and Wildlife.
[00:01:35] Speaker B: Yes. Heather with Texas PCI or Playa Conservation Initiative.
[00:01:39] Speaker A: Yes. Yeah. So she, she. But she spent also some time on the radio. So we, we've just launched a Friday radio show, so we'll have to have you on that too. And you can give us a little, kind of a little bit, maybe not quite as in depth as we're gonna have today, but so to reach that audience as well. So give us a little background. Are you a Lubbock kid? Are you a West Texas kid?
[00:02:07] Speaker B: No. So my background, so I'm raised or was born in San Antonio and raised in a little town of Bernie, just north of San Antonio. And so my passion has always been for the outdoors. And I grew up going hunting, fishing, camping, doing Boy Scouts.
I'm an Eagle Scout, actually, I was
[00:02:26] Speaker A: about to say, I bet you're an Eagle Scout.
[00:02:27] Speaker B: Yes, ma'. Am. And then so with my raising and then wildlife photography, that's always been a huge one in my life.
And so for my family, our vacations, all of our activity and quality time revolved around going outside and spending time together in the outdoors. So that really inspired me to go and pursue an education in the wildlife and natural resources field.
So I went and did my undergrad in wildlife and fishery sciences at Texas A and M University and also got a double major in entomology. So I love the bugs.
[00:03:03] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:03:04] Speaker B: I have a real. In my photography, too. I have a real detailed eye looking for small things, and so I can be entertained by a field of flowers or watching bees or something in a field for a long time.
[00:03:17] Speaker A: So your photography is beautiful.
[00:03:20] Speaker B: Well, thank you.
[00:03:20] Speaker A: Amazing. People are going to be start seeing it on our website pretty soon.
[00:03:23] Speaker B: Oh, well, that's awesome. Thank you.
And so after doing that, I've done several field internships as well during my time when I was an undergrad student. And so I worked in the Rolling Plains Quail Research Ranch near Roby, Texas. We're doing research on quail.
I also worked in Colorado for a summer season working on an elk calf research project.
And then after graduation, I went and worked in Oklahoma on a wild turkey research project in southeastern Oklahoma.
And then after that, I decided I wanted to pursue a master's degree, and that's what brought me to Lubbock, and I pursued natural resources master's degree at Texas Tech University.
[00:04:07] Speaker A: That happens a lot. Aggies go there and then they come here.
[00:04:10] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:04:11] Speaker A: That happens a lot.
[00:04:12] Speaker B: Yep. I've known a lot of people, a lot of my mentors. That's been the case.
[00:04:15] Speaker A: So.
[00:04:16] Speaker B: So.
[00:04:16] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. So interesting.
So you in. In San Antonio, it's a completely different setup as far as water goes.
It's not as much groundwater.
Well, yes, there is some.
[00:04:35] Speaker B: There is.
[00:04:35] Speaker A: Are y'.
[00:04:36] Speaker B: All.
[00:04:36] Speaker A: Are y' all for the Edwards?
[00:04:37] Speaker B: We are. Yeah. So the. Okay, so up here in the Panhandle, it's the. It's the Ogallala Aquifer that everyone considers concerned about. But growing up in San Antonio, it was the Edwards Aquifer. And there's, you know, once we're not. We're just disposed to drought as well.
[00:04:54] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:04:55] Speaker B: And we also were concerned about groundwater. And, you know, when we have a real hot summer or a series of really hot summers, then there's water restrictions in the city. And so we grew up on our own. Well, and so that was a concern, too, is if the water ever gets to a certain level of, you know, cutting back and just being aware and trying to mitigate those water losses as best we can. So the interesting thing about the Edwards Aquifer is that there is actually a recharge zone, the Balcones fault zone. And that's where, you know, it's a karst aquifer. So the water runs. Once it falls or rainfall, you get all the. These water traveling down towards the aquifer through the porous limestone.
[00:05:38] Speaker A: A lot faster.
[00:05:38] Speaker B: It's a lot faster.
And then. But compared to up here in the Ogallala, it's mainly playas that is the primary mechanism of recharge for groundwater.
[00:05:49] Speaker A: And you know, what I think is interesting, because there has historically been so much water in the Ogallala, and until probably the 90s, I mean, I never heard anybody talk about us running out of water, you know, and now I will say I have watched the Kens burn. Ken Burns documentary, like, I don't know how many times. And there is a farmer on there that said, someday they're going to ask us, why'd you use all the water?
And I was like, yeah, this. And he's. This guy was.
He was an older gentleman then. So I don't know how old that documentary is, but that was probably several decades ago, you know, But I don't.
I think, you know, we're technically supposed to only water. If you end up an odd number on your house, you can water on Tuesdays and Thursdays or. You know what I mean, that kind of stuff. I've never seen him. For enforcement of that. I don't know, you know, who technically follows it? I mean, ours is set to schedule like that. But, you know, I.
I don't think that we have any conception of real water restrictions, you know, and I think because we haven't just.
We just had. We don't have as many people pulling from our aquifer, and our aquifer is bigger.
[00:07:06] Speaker B: Mm. Yeah.
[00:07:06] Speaker A: And so it is something that I think could be coming, you know.
[00:07:11] Speaker B: Well, and to add onto that as well, I mean, here in the Panhandle and the High Plains, we're the most agriculturalized area of the state. And so the irrigation withdrawals, that is definitely the number one user of water in the region.
So there's.
[00:07:29] Speaker A: Right. So it's 50% of all the water in Texas is irrigation, and 80% of that is here.
I just saw the statistics yesterday.
[00:07:38] Speaker B: So, I mean, that's a huge amount of water that's being used, not to even mention the population growth that we're seeing and the amount of, you know, the municipalities that are going to be using water. The, The. The newest, biggest concern is the data centers for AI. So, I mean, there's all kinds of. There's a lot more water users in the Region too, that are all, we're all using the same resource of that groundwater.
[00:08:02] Speaker A: And you know, I think interesting is like that, like the amount of water that's used in oil and gas, you know, for fracking is, it's interesting because it's kind of like question mark.
We don't know for sure. I was like you really? Really? But do you not know for sure? Yeah, you know, so that's a whole nother, you know, not necessarily are they. Some of it's over the Ogallala, most of it is, you know, past us, that south of us. But I, I think it's important to also note that even though we do use that much water, I would say that every bit of that water is used very, very strategically and, and very efficiently. You know, and so I would, you know, I would love to see the data on, you know, how much the reduction in use as far as like how much it's gone down as conservation efforts have been put in because, you know, a lot of people and more people would put in drip if you could afford to do it.
[00:09:07] Speaker B: Right, right. Well, and there's, and I think there is like you just mentioned a lot of conservation movement around this in this entire area, all concerned about the natural resources, the water for people, for water, for wildlife, for communities.
And so, you know, we're talking, we, I work mostly with the playas, but you know, we try to talk to community members and community leaders about, you know, these playas. They are a nature based tool or a solution that could be helpful for a community, especially in a local concentrated area for providing recharge for the, for future generations. Because I think it's really important, you know, for communities to think about their total water budget. You know, you may have, you might, you might be thinking about, you know, these are irrigation efficient practices, talking about, you know, rainwater harvesting, talking about, you know, using water to its, you know, maximum, maximum capacity and you know, using reclaimed water, produced water. I mean those are all conversations all these communities are having, but also including incorporating playas into that broader water management plan and you know, using it, using them to their full potential.
[00:10:22] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. And I think it's, it's just got to be part, it needs to be, it must be part of the strategy, you know, and, and what's interesting to me is, you know, I've, I've always felt like, oh, this is a beat this horse to death talking about flies, you know, but I'm so surprised how many people still are not aware of the recharge rate and Just. And that's just the, you know, estimated, you know, recharge rate. Like, you know, that's not even, like, specific to your playa, you know, But I think that we have a lot more work to do with landowners and making them more aware. And I will say, probably of. I've talked to hundreds of people about playas between the Emerald Farm show and all the other things. Um, I've talked to a lot of people about playas, and I've only had one person say, but that's the only place that we ever have, you know, any, you know, most years, this one place where we have any production. And I'm like, that is the. That's the opposite of what everyone else says, you know, which is like, well, you might have something every morning, one's every 10 years or something, maybe, you know. And so, you know, the opportunities now for these type of programs and. And they're on a lot of radars for a lot of corporate dollars, too. And there's money out there to have it done, you know, and so we have a list that we started through our.
Our legacy is tomorrow's water, you know, so we've got a list of folks that are kind of waiting there. And I think it's a. There's. The money's there, the opportunity's there. We just need to make sure that landowners understand and especially if you have, you know, a deep dive into a single county like they did in. I think it's Swisher county, isn't it, where they did. I think it's. Their water table stabilized there, you know, and so. What a great model, you know, yet.
And I think I'm trying to remember, Joe, if. Do you remember what percentage of their playas were restored there? It wasn't all of them.
[00:12:25] Speaker B: It wasn't all of them for sure. I do not know the exact percentage.
[00:12:29] Speaker A: I feel like it was like 30% or something, but I could be wrong about that. That.
[00:12:33] Speaker B: Well, and to talk about, like, the conditions of these playas, you know, that's what our work is. Playa Lakes Joint Venture and Tomorrow's Water. We're working with landowners and communities to restore these playas because it's like 80% of the playas within, you know, have been modified by. In some way, shape or form. And those modifications all look different because every playa is very different.
But it, you know, most of the time we encounter that there's been some kind of pit dug into the. In the middle of it or to the side, and what that kind of does is it reduces the recharge capacity or potential of that playa. Because typically a playa in its natural conditions is gonna have to have a wet and dry cycle, just like any wetland. And the thing about playas is that their natural state or their steady state is actually being dry.
And so what happens with a pit is we remove all that valuable clay layer that's in the playa basin, and it's going to. That water is just going to go straight into the aquifer carrying all the sediments, all the contaminants with it. And so that water is not being filtered properly by the clay. It's, you know, it's going rapid, traveling rapidly towards the aquifer, but it's of a lower quality than if it were, you know, slowed down by the clay.
So when we're talking about restoring playas, it's all about, you know, reversing these modifications. So it could be as easy as going and filling that pit back up with that clay that was taken out of it.
Typically, all these playas have been. Have been affected by sediments that have accumulated in the clay basin. So removing that accumulated sediment and just so that that clay layer is exposed
[00:14:19] Speaker A: and that sediment's due to the fact that there's not.
Most of them don't have a grass buffer to catch that sediment.
[00:14:27] Speaker B: Correct. You know, we have so much of. There's a lot of wind erosion and a lot of the sediments that are carried in from agricultural fields. You know, and that's the big point is that there's not a healthy vegetation buffer around this, around these playas to catch those sediments and prevent them from traveling into the basin. So. So that's another thing that we do a lot of work on is restoring those vegetation buffers, planting them with native vegetation, preferably just so that there's something, usually grass, that there's something to catch those sediments. But it also allows the water to freely enter the playa after a big rainstorm event so that runoff can freely enter it. And there's no channels or like really erosion, drainage features, we try to reduce those and fix those as well.
[00:15:18] Speaker A: So would you call it.
This is my ignorance showing. But so would you call those the areas where that.
Because the water is landing and it's coming into. It's not staying really where it is. It goes into all these playas here on the high plains. Would you call those watersheds?
[00:15:36] Speaker B: Well, and though the playas themselves, they kind of are like an isolated watershed.
[00:15:40] Speaker A: An isolated watershed. Okay.
[00:15:42] Speaker B: Because that water, it's eventually going to evaporate, or it's going to. To travel towards the aquifer. But the playas themselves, they all act on, like, an individual level. They're not connected underground. They're connected to the aquifer, but they're not connected to each other.
[00:15:56] Speaker A: So you wouldn't call them a waterway or they're a wetland, but they're not a navigable.
You can't navigate that.
[00:16:03] Speaker B: Correct. So they're not navigable. They're not considered navigable waters. So they're not, like, federally protected as such. But the water that travels to them, it will either, like I said, it will evaporate or it will travel towards the aquifer. And every playa behaves differently. And that's what's really interesting about playas is that they're all kind of their own.
[00:16:29] Speaker A: Like a snowflake.
[00:16:30] Speaker B: They're all. Yeah, like a snowflake.
[00:16:31] Speaker A: They're the same.
[00:16:32] Speaker B: It's not every playa. Every playa is different in one way or another. So every project that we do a restoration on, it's kind of to look a little different. So a lot of times people ask us, well, how much does a restoration cost? How much does it. You know, it all varies so much.
So there is no, like, model playa, as you could say.
[00:16:54] Speaker A: Yes. Yeah, that's. That. That is. And I think that's part of the, you know, trying to figure out how to get that answer, because so much of it has to do with what's going down, what's going on underneath the ground that we don't really know, like, how deep is. How far is it to water and how deep is that water that's there and how. There's a lot of different things.
[00:17:12] Speaker B: And I wanted to emphasize, like you said, also, that they are temporary wetlands. And so a lot of. A lot of landowners that I talk to, they're concerned. They're like, well, my playa is dry all the time. But that's okay because you could have one rain event, and then it will be full for maybe days to weeks to months.
But that's just natural because they are wetlands, and wetlands are productive because they go through that natural wet, dry cycle. And it may be dry for years, but that shouldn't be a concern because that means it's, you know, it's doing fine. The play is still working for you, even if it's dry, even if it. Or if it gets full of water. I mean, it's.
[00:17:51] Speaker A: Well, and it's amazing what happens when they get wet.
And we've had this conversation before. I think on. Probably on the podcast. I can't remember. We have a lot now, but you and I and Taven Ducks Unlimited were in Terry county visiting with NRCS Soul conservation folks.
And they had. Can you remember the story that they told us about the bucket of water? They took a picture.
[00:18:28] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, yeah.
[00:18:29] Speaker A: A gallon.
[00:18:30] Speaker B: The. From the Soil and Water Conservation District. They had like a. They took like a.
I want to say like a scoop. It was probably a couple scoops of that clay that was in the basin of the playa. And they put it in a bucket and they put it in their office. And I think it was just for, like, show and tell.
[00:18:47] Speaker A: Yeah. She did it for school, right? Yeah.
[00:18:50] Speaker B: And then later on, something hatched out of that clay layer. It was like a. Like a salamander.
[00:18:56] Speaker A: What she said it was just like. It just grew up really big in plants first. And then she was like. Because it was in a milk jug, I think, is what they put it in.
And it was in her windowsill. And she said she looked over there one day and something was moving around in there.
It's crazy. All of the things that are.
Life that's there.
[00:19:16] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, that's one of the things that has always interested me, I mean, coming from a background in education and wildlife, is, you know, seeing these playas and they're like, as a productive wetland ecosystem, it's really just incredible how many species. I mean, they're the biodiversity hotspots of this region and.
[00:19:35] Speaker A: Oh, the type of plants that are. That are just there and they're dormant, just waiting for the right season, right time.
[00:19:43] Speaker B: Yeah. And because they have that, you know, that wet, dry cycle, it really.
It all affects the plant communities and. And how they respond. And you'll see kind of that gradient of plant communities through a playa. Like, there's not going to be a whole lot of plant life in the middle because of that thick clay layer, which is just really hard for roots to get established in and for root movement. But then you look at, like, the edges and the surrounding soils and the plants that start to grow up, but because they're, you know, they go wet and they go dry, it produces or its best conditions for a lot of annual plants. But those annual plants produce lots of seeds. They produce lots of good forage for birds, for waterfowl. So, I mean, you've got this. All of these conditions are kind of working together, and it's what makes them so special, because you don't have that anywhere else, you know, in the high plains. So so
[00:20:38] Speaker A: do you, do you know, are there other regions in the globe where there are playas?
[00:20:45] Speaker B: Well, we have unique playas for our region in the, in the Playa Lakes joint venture. We cover the whole Playa Lakes region and it goes all the way up to Nebraska. And then there's another joint venture called the Rainwater Basin joint venture. And they, they're also working in Nebraska with Playa Lakes. But overall we, we have the only Playa lakes. And in North America there are also saline lakes that are.
[00:21:09] Speaker A: Yes. So yes.
[00:21:10] Speaker B: That are special and they are kind of, I want to say they're considered a type of like. Or maybe a relative of playas.
[00:21:17] Speaker A: Yeah, we lived not far from when my husband and I were farming in Terry County. We lived not far from a very large saline lake.
So we were out there not long ago. We just, we went out there to see sandhill cranes which were. There were not very many, but there were a few.
[00:21:34] Speaker B: Yeah. Where was that? Where was that exactly?
[00:21:37] Speaker A: It's, I think it's actually in Gaines county. So it's just right over the Terry Line. Terry county line. There's a lot of oil and gas production out there. So there's a lot of pump jacks, you know, right out there and stuff. So.
[00:21:49] Speaker B: Yeah, well, and then, and we're very, we're very fortunate in Texas. We're very blessed to have be in the middle of the Central Flyway. So we get all kinds of bird life, migratory birds, waterfowl, shorebirds, cranes. I mean, and they all use playas to an extent because those playas are really important stop over sites when they have water in them. So when they're full of water and during those migration times, it's really important for these birds to get the, just to have those places to rest and to, you know, kind of refuel.
I mean it's, they, they again, like the, the wet, dry cycle of a playa. They produce great abundance of invertebrates and that's really important for, for migratory waterfowl and shorebirds to have that fuel and to have, you know, something just to keep them going.
[00:22:38] Speaker A: Yeah, so. So, so let's just say I'm a, and I am, I'm a Playa Lake landowner and I want to restore my playa.
What do I do and what are you going to do?
[00:22:52] Speaker B: Yeah, so we have, there's lots of great folks at Playa Lakes joint venture and that work with tomorrow's water. So when we get a landowner who contacts us or we find a landowner who's interested in restoring their playa Usually it just starts with a conversation about understanding what their. What are their goals for their property and what are their management goals? What does their operation look like? You know, because we want to be mindful and cognizant of everything that's going on and how we can best tailor this plan to their needs, whether it's the needs of the landowner or that community's needs.
So it usually just starts with conversations and just getting, you know, that building that trust and that relationship. And then we go and we usually conduct like a site visit. You know, we will look at the satellite imagery once we have that playa location, and we look at some of the history of the satellite imagery, you know, looking for any of those modifications that I talked about. You know, is there a native vegetation buffer? Is there a pit in the middle of this playa?
Because oftentimes, like, if you go out there and it's, you know, it's completely wet, you might not see the pit, or if it's completely dry, you might miss maybe a drainage feature.
So it helps to look at all that imagery beforehand. And then we can go out. We could do a on the ground, you know, groundproofing site visit, usually visiting with the landowner or the community member who's interested, and we'll talk about, you know, what kind of options are they looking for? Do they want to enroll the playa acreage into an existing conservation. Conservation program, you know, like CRP or EQUIP or REP with Wetlands Reserve Easement program or enhancement program. I'm sorry, partnership program.
It's long. We may have fixed that.
[00:24:39] Speaker A: And, And. And all of the. All of them have some kind of long, long acronyms.
[00:24:45] Speaker B: Yes, they do. And they're changed. There's.
[00:24:48] Speaker A: They change all the time.
[00:24:48] Speaker B: Change all the time.
[00:24:49] Speaker A: Exactly, exactly.
[00:24:50] Speaker B: So, no, but there's a lot of different options for the landowner to be compensated or to not have to do any of the share any of the cost of that restoration process.
[00:25:00] Speaker A: I think that's what's important, is they're important enough in our ecosystem in that people have recognized how vital they are to the future of our water, that they're like, we'll give you a fee per acre for any inconvenience, and we'll do all the work for free.
[00:25:20] Speaker B: Yeah. And like Texas Playa Conservation Initiative that we work with, with Tomorrow's Water and Ducks Unlimited. So all of them, they're kind of the technical on the grounds, moving the dirt work project leaders.
And so we work with Heather Johnson a lot and Tavin Dotson With Ducks Unlimited. So we'll bring in those partners and we'll all go out there and that's the conversation like, you know, the landowner usually wants. They either want wildlife benefits or they want groundwater recharge or they want, you know, maybe some kind of conservation incentive payment.
[00:25:56] Speaker A: Man, you could get all three and
[00:25:57] Speaker B: you can get all of them. Yeah, it's just, it just all depends on what you're willing to do.
[00:26:00] Speaker A: Right.
[00:26:01] Speaker B: And so. And you can. There's all kinds of different lengths of time if you want to enter that easement into 10 year, 30 year, or into, you know, forever, there's different options for that.
[00:26:12] Speaker A: And I know some people are like super creative about how they've gone about enrolling things and, and playas into CRPs and different things too. And so I think there's some good opportunities now. So let's do a little family tree.
So we have Playa Lakes joint venture.
What is Tomorrow's Water?
[00:26:32] Speaker B: So Tomorrow's Water is one of our programs that is going through Playa Lakes joint venture.
So the Tomorrow's Water model, it is a collaborative partnership and it is working with the technical, like technical partners and the financial partners and connecting them with the private landowners who want to do playa restoration. And it's all revolved around this, you know, partnership based, voluntary process that we will work with them and connect them to their right partners so that they can, you know, do that restoration, hopefully at no cost to them.
[00:27:08] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, exactly. Well, I see you got your notes there. She making sure we don't forget anything.
[00:27:15] Speaker B: And I was just gonna say so. I mean, Tomorrow's Water is an adaptive collaborative process that helps local communities, private landowners and agricultural producers connect with technical and financial partners to create an actionable plan to stabilize the community's water supply. And this is done by incorporating Playa restoration into these broader water conservation planning efforts.
[00:27:37] Speaker A: And I think it's really important to note that like, it genuinely can help a community.
[00:27:42] Speaker B: Yes, it can help. And I mean, playas, they are the mechanism for recharge in our area, in our region. So. And if you've got playas that are really close to municipal wells, public wells, that's something that, you know, it's just,
[00:27:57] Speaker A: it's just a low hanging fruit. And you know, I always like to quote Robert Mason, I ask him, you know, what's the. What, what can we do here? And he said, it's not a, it's not a silver bullet. It's gold buckshot. So it's, it's one of those Gold buckshots.
[00:28:10] Speaker B: Yeah, it is. And it works at a really good local level.
[00:28:13] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:28:14] Speaker B: And that's so it. And then so it involves local partners, it involves local community members. So it's all locally driven conservation efforts, which is wonderful.
[00:28:23] Speaker A: Which is like, that's, that's what, that's what works and that's what sticks.
[00:28:26] Speaker B: It works.
[00:28:27] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So are you visiting with communities so far? Have you got some, some folks that have reached out or have you connected with some people in communities about.
Especially the ones where they're. They're pulling from these wells.
[00:28:41] Speaker B: Yes. So we're, we're talking to several communities in the region. In particular, we're talking to cities like Hereford in Deaf Smith County.
[00:28:49] Speaker A: Yeah, they're always forward thinking.
[00:28:51] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:28:52] Speaker A: Stuff like that.
[00:28:52] Speaker B: They're very involved and they are. They're doing lots of making great steps and strides into conserve and creating a community water plan.
[00:29:01] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:29:01] Speaker B: I was actually just out there a few weeks ago. They had their conference that was Ogalala Commons. Ogallala Commons.
[00:29:08] Speaker A: Great, great group.
[00:29:09] Speaker B: Yeah, for sure. And they do a lot of education outreach, talking all about playas. They also have a leadership cohort.
I'm actually part of the, the Playa cohort right now. So they're doing all kinds of great efforts.
[00:29:23] Speaker A: Yes. And they have online education on their website. People should check that out.
[00:29:30] Speaker B: They should. Yeah.
[00:29:31] Speaker A: We'll. We'll link that Ogallala Commons in the show notes.
[00:29:37] Speaker B: And so we've got Hereford. We're also talking to. There's the, the cities of Farwell and Texaco on the Texas New Mexico border.
[00:29:47] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:29:47] Speaker B: And so what I wanted to mention too is that we have.
Tomorrow's water is not just in Texas. We have conservation outreach specialists, which is what I am. We have a. One in eastern New Mexico. We have one in Oklahoma. We have one in Colorado and we also have several in Kansas.
[00:30:05] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:30:06] Speaker B: So we're. We're kind of covering large areas and I cover the whole Texas panhandle so well.
[00:30:12] Speaker A: The area where there's. I mean, that is a big area. But where we're talking about those playas, it's like really. I mean, Floyd, I think, is. Isn't Floyd the biggest. It's like 1600, I think, that are there in Floyd County.
[00:30:24] Speaker B: I think Floyd. Yes. Has the highest density of playas.
[00:30:26] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:30:27] Speaker B: And so really concentrated playas in that area. So. Yeah, but we, I mean, there's playas all over the Panhandle, but yeah, they're kind of. They're not features like found all over Oklahoma or all over Colorado.
[00:30:38] Speaker A: Exactly. Just over the Aqua Ogallala.
[00:30:41] Speaker B: Correct.
[00:30:42] Speaker A: And not the entire Ogallala.
And there are areas where there's other means of recharge.
[00:30:50] Speaker B: Yes. Rainwater basins.
[00:30:52] Speaker A: Yes. But for us, that is not true.
[00:30:54] Speaker B: That is very. Yeah, we. That's why I said we. You know, we can say that playas are a mechanism, but. And really, in the high Plains, it is the mechanism.
[00:31:04] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:31:05] Speaker B: For recharge.
[00:31:05] Speaker A: Yes, exactly.
Yeah. So, I mean, the. I think it's easy to think, you know, it's not. It's not a.
Well, you could say it's not a quick fix, but in some cases it can. You can see results pretty quickly. You know, just depends on what your ply is. But I. I think the argument that it's not, you know, oh, it'll take 100 years or whatever is like, well, do you want water here in 100 years or not?
[00:31:30] Speaker B: Mm, yeah, that's the question. And that's what I think. A lot of our landowners that I talk to on a regular basis, that's what they're most concerned is this, you know, their ranching legacy and what they're going to leave for future generations, because, you know, if they've got family and they got, you know, kids that are going to inherit the ranch or the, you know, the farm producer operation, you know.
[00:31:52] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:31:52] Speaker B: What are you leaving behind? And it may not totally affect you in the. In this 50 years, but it's going to affect your future.
[00:32:01] Speaker A: Right. And I think, you know, I think most people would say, like, that their worldview would say that, you know, we.
We want to, you know, think about the people that come after us and, you know, we want to leave a legacy. That's why we called our. Our effort to, like, recruit people. Our legacy. That's our legacy. You know, tomorrow's water, whether we leave it or whether it's gone, we'll be the generation that's remembered for that. Even though, you know, I mean, I think it's going to be up to us.
[00:32:29] Speaker B: It will. Well, and I was going to add, too, that we know this model, tomorrow's water model is successful, and we've seen the impact of playa restoration can have on individual landowner operations and in communities.
So I'll read real quick a quote by Mike Morris, the mayor of Clovis in New Mexico. He says that my advice to other cities and other mayors would be to have a plan and work that plan, but to keep an open mind and be ready to implement new ideas that come along, such as leveraging Playa Lakes as a way to recharge the aquifer. And so we would mention La Donna Clayton, and she's been very impactful in the city of Clovis. And they have a master water assurance plan that took several years for them to create with the help of their water advisory Board and working with the state of New Mexico and Cannon Air Force Base.
[00:33:20] Speaker A: The amazing thing to me about their water plan is that they're implementing it.
[00:33:24] Speaker B: Yeah, and they're implementing it and they're using Playas as one of the pliers are heavily mentioned in the plan as using. It's this source of future water.
And so I mean, we can, you know, we can make temporary solutions like drilling more wells, but at that same time, it's a temporary solution.
[00:33:43] Speaker A: Right. And I think about. I heard this week that Pflugerville is like out of water and they're, they're working on some pipeline or something, something. And I'm like, now that the water's gone.
You know what I mean? Like what, like what?
You know, and I know that we have. This is, you know, probably like a question probably that you, you don't necessarily know the answer to. But I do wonder, like, we all have our plans and all of. All of our regions, our Texas water belt regions, we all build these plans
[00:34:13] Speaker B: and like, what's the trigger when the well goes dry?
[00:34:18] Speaker A: I guess I don't. In fact, I just interviewed. Great interview with the.
He is the chief administrator, I believe, of the agency, the Texas Water Development. Great conversation. Really nice guy. And I felt like I might have asked him that, which is really embarrassing because, like, I just talked to a lot of people and I can't remember everything. So.
So if you are. That one will come before this one. So you may have already heard the, the listeners probably already heard the answer to that question and they probably will remember, so. But I do. That's one of the things I think that is just amazing to me is like, I just really value people that like, are implementing things, you know, that are trying things even if it doesn't work.
Like, it's, it's a time to like, throw everything at it.
You know, if it has. If it's shown, like, you don't have to be stupid about it. But, you know, it's, it's. We're. We're. We're there at that place, at that place. And, and you know, when I first started doing this, the Playa stuff, I was like, yeah, this is pretty important, but the longer we've gone I've been like, this is actually super important to do this.
[00:35:35] Speaker B: Yes, it is. And especially, I mean, water is the foundation of life.
[00:35:40] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:35:41] Speaker B: It's going to.
[00:35:41] Speaker A: Right.
[00:35:42] Speaker B: Everything is know, affected by water. We can't live, we can't exist here without water. And so it's going to take everybody's, you know, part to make this happen.
[00:35:52] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:35:53] Speaker B: And it involves every, you know, every stakeholder, every local landowner, private landowner, a rancher or producer. I mean it involves everybody.
[00:36:01] Speaker A: Everybody's got to participate. Yep, yep, yep. Well, you have, you have any thoughts that you want to leave us with? Well, tell me what else you got there.
[00:36:10] Speaker B: Well, just telling everybody and just letting them know that we are here and tomorrow's water is, you know, we're ready to help serve communities and help them in any way that we can because we know that each community is unique and different. So all their water management plan and strategy will be different and their model with tomorrow's water will be different. So in many cases the work that we do, it includes pairing playa restoration with efforts to reduce aquifer overuse through your irrigation efficiency and other methods. But once water has been reduced, then functionally restored playas can provide a sustainable source of future water for local communities.
[00:36:51] Speaker A: Yeah. And I think too it's important to remember that like that the municipality water is vital too. I mean, you know, so sometimes it's, I think I'm just thinking water in terms of irrigation because of the economic like that. These communities are, you know, they're built on this foundation of ag.
[00:37:17] Speaker B: Almost all these communities, all of them are very dependent. They're very dependent on an ag driven economy.
[00:37:22] Speaker A: Right.
[00:37:23] Speaker B: And the interesting thing too is that I think in the projected over time we are going to see that the trend is actually going to be reduced irrigation in agriculture.
[00:37:33] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:37:34] Speaker B: And it's going to be an increase in municipal water. So municipal water usage is going to, I think, irrigation.
[00:37:39] Speaker A: Yeah, I mean, I think this next year we're going to, I think, I think we're heading into a season we're going to see that dramatically because I've heard multiple people like talk about that. They're not even going to turn like they're going to grow something that's like either low or no irrigation.
[00:37:57] Speaker B: Mm.
[00:37:57] Speaker A: You know, because.
[00:38:00] Speaker B: Which is a very, it's a very tough conversation to have with landowners. I mean this is their livelihood, this is their, this is what they have done for generations.
[00:38:09] Speaker A: Well, and I think for landowners even more than farmers, because farmers mostly are farming the majority of land. They're farming is not their own. And so they are held, you know, captive by what that landlord wants. But I can tell you now, I mean, I know of a situation where, you know, landlord couldn't find anybody to farm their land. Mm. There's no water. They're hard to deal with.
[00:38:36] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:38:37] Speaker A: You know, and so, you know, it's an interesting time.
[00:38:41] Speaker B: Well, and once that water, you know, once it's gone, you know.
[00:38:45] Speaker A: Right.
[00:38:46] Speaker B: The. The value of your land just goes down.
[00:38:49] Speaker A: Yeah, well, you would think so. It is definitely less than irrigated land. But I'll tell you, land values have really.
It's interesting, fabulously interesting to me that how they have held steady considering what's happening, you know, and so, you know, when it sells, which is not, you know, very often, that land changes hands, but it does happen from time to time.
[00:39:12] Speaker B: Sure. And it gets divided up too, so.
[00:39:15] Speaker A: Yep.
[00:39:15] Speaker B: And then you're bringing even more people to the table and deciding what you're going to do and when you're dividing up the land or.
[00:39:22] Speaker A: Exactly, exactly.
[00:39:23] Speaker B: But I wanted to also emphasize, though, I mean, just some of the role or my role with tomorrow's water and just some of the things that we are doing in communities that, you know, other communities might be interested in. We, you know, we work with community leaders to help incorporate the playa restoration into their existing water conservation plan.
[00:39:43] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:39:43] Speaker B: You know, we. I've gone and spoken to city councils at different communities and talking to them, sitting in on, like, regional water planning committee meetings. So just, you know, talking and discussing about how we can include playa restoration into these broader water quantity quality plans.
We help landowners in the community determine if that what is needed to restore a playa to help connect them to those technical financial partners so that a dollar doesn't come out of their wallet for it.
They get paid for it. So.
And so in just supporting their management goals, but. And then connecting Playa landowners with those conservation programs, like I said, that are already existing. But we're also doing some work to try and bring new conservation programs that are already working in other states, but we want to bring them to Texas.
[00:40:33] Speaker A: Awesome.
Oh, that sounds great. That's one of the reasons that we took Lacey's conservation organization that she's had for all these years, and we rebranded Sarah because we saw all of these things happening in other states or on the east side of the state, but mostly in other states, and went, why are we not doing any of this? Like, I've never even heard of this. Why isn't this happening? So that's exciting to me. And we'll have to follow up and have another conversation about what you're talking about and.
[00:41:02] Speaker B: Right.
[00:41:02] Speaker A: Get those things up and rolling.
[00:41:04] Speaker B: And I think like as we've seen in this last year, I mean Texas is really invested in the groundwater and invested in water in general. So for example, like we just saw or we're seeing that the Texas Water Development Board is going to send out a request for proposals for a new grant. It's a brand new grant that they've just opened up this year because they had House Bill 500, it was a supplementary appropriations bill that they were given. They have $1 billion to give to communities to, to address their water supply and infrastructure needs. So that's something that we've Playa Lakes joint venture, we contributed public comment to and we're trying to get playas kind of written into that broader conversation about Playas being green infrastructure. They're a nature based tool for stormwater and for recharge. And recharge addressing that water supply issue. So we're working in several different areas right now. But I think I'm really hopeful that there's a lot of great, you know, upcoming stuff for Texas and for Texas landowners.
[00:42:09] Speaker A: Absolutely. Thanks for coming.
[00:42:11] Speaker B: Yeah, well, thank you. And you know, anyone who is interested in learning more about how their Playa can work for them can contact me. They can go and learn more about Playas and the benefits that they
[email protected] yeah, that's. And they can reach me. My email is joe.richardsljv.org and I can give my cell phone number is 806-370-0657.
Get in touch with me and then yeah, I would love to have a conversation and talk about how playas can
[00:42:45] Speaker A: work for them and we'll put all of that information in the show notes. Yes. So people can go there. And our, our website, sarah-conservation.com has also a link. It has a Playa Lake page and it links to, to apply his work for Texans and it has some information there as well. And I think it's a great opportunity and there's, there's a little money to be had, not a ton but it's, it's any bit helps and, and it's not something that's going to cost people.
It's only beneficial.
[00:43:18] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:43:19] Speaker A: Yeah. For now and for the future. So I hope that you will take the opportunity to if this doesn't impact you. But you know someone that it does share this podcast and share Joe's information and let let folks know. And we will see you again on another episode of Conservation Stories by.
